That's great—15% to 20%. It's more than the price that's put on pollution, then, which is good. It shows that....
We were talking about returns on investment. I think it was Ms. Brekveld who was talking about that. I'd like to talk about it in this context. When we're looking at the price on pollution, which is obviously a cost that's added or put on the emissions, not on farmers but on the emissions they've emitted into the environment, I'm just wondering....
You were talking about the return on investments, Ms. Brekveld. Part of the calculation, as I recall from my finance days, is that you look at the costs you're going to save when you calculate whether a new investment is worth making—