Evidence of meeting #27 for Fisheries and Oceans in the 40th Parliament, 2nd Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was crisis.

A recording is available from Parliament.

On the agenda

MPs speaking

Also speaking

Léonard Poirier  Secretary-Treasurer, Alliance des pêcheurs professionnels du Québec

11:35 a.m.

Secretary-Treasurer, Alliance des pêcheurs professionnels du Québec

Léonard Poirier

Fishers in the Magdalen Islands or in Quebec may not have the same concerns about employment insurance. Obviously, measures aimed at supporting fishing activity would alleviate the costs associated with the wages of fisher helpers. These wages represent a major expense. Consequently, any measure that would help fishing business owners to cover the wages of their fishing boat crew would be appreciated in Quebec and the Magdalen Islands.

With respect to income and price security, the fishers of the Magdalen Islands have made an effort, in so far as the FRCC is concerned. In our minds, it is clear that this crisis is tied to economic circumstances that are specific to the Magdalen Islands. We hope that new intervention measures will be applied in the future. First and foremost, we want to emerge from this crisis situation in the short term, but any new measures should address the situation in the industry in the short, medium and long term. Parallel action is required. For that reason, I would like to see a wide-ranging study undertaken. I'm not necessarily calling for a commission of inquiry, but rather for a commission that would have a mandate to examine the whole issue of income security in the industry. We have seen similar commissions in the past. It is truly unfair that our fishers are being treated differently, even though they are entitled to employment insurance.

This could, in my opinion, be one way of dealing with the situation By no means am I calling into question employment insurance.That program is greatly appreciated. Nevertheless, I believe additional measures can be considered to further take into account the plight of fishing operations. Employment insurance is a comprehensive income security measure that is not directly tied to business profitability. For that reason, additional programs or measures are needed. They may not be of the same magnitude as those introduced in the agricultural sector, but we are not asking that they be.

While some have always believed that we were asking for similar consideration, that is not true. In any case, we do not compare ourselves to the agricultural industry, where programs have been affected by major inflation and have had to be reviewed, and rightly so in my opinion, because of overproduction. Farmers started to produce too much. The situation is very different in the fishing industry where a resource is harvested. The “pie“ is clearly defined. Overproduction is impossible. It's different for people who grow products and who may over-produce, and for financial aid programs that are subject to inflation. We are not in this kind of situation, and that is an advantage for us.

These programs are not free. They must rely on the contribution of fishers. Our ability to invest in these programs is more limited than is the case for farmers. So then, any programs targeting our industry would not be costly, compared to ones designed to help the agricultural industry.

Finally, as far as the Americans are concerned, unfortunately I cannot give you a specific answer to your question. My knowledge of what transpired is fairly limited. I do know that funds were allocated to certain parties, but from what I understand, the money was provided by oil companies that were helping communities as part of certain programs.

11:40 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Rodney Weston

Thank you, Monsieur Poirier.

Mr. Weston.

May 26th, 2009 / 11:40 a.m.

Conservative

John Weston Conservative West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast—Sea to Sky Country, BC

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Mr. Poirier, I am an MP from beautiful BC. I am also a great fan of the other “belle province“ and I am delighted to welcome you here today.

After listening to the testimony of several individuals who have dealings with the government, I get the sense that lobster fishers are pretty much the same as other fishers. They are not necessarily advocating one across-the-board solution. One woman who testified before the committee said she was opposed to any solution that would involve a slew of new regulations. When a group deals with the government, it is natural for it to seek out a solution that will affect all of its members.

I also noticed that there was no broad marketing plan in place for lobster fishers. When questions were asked about how the Chinese or Asian market was being handled, I was not clear to me whether all project participants were getting the best possible results for their members. There seems to be a conflict between the individual, and the group.

In your opinion, how could problems like this be resolved?

11:45 a.m.

Secretary-Treasurer, Alliance des pêcheurs professionnels du Québec

Léonard Poirier

You are right on the money with your comment about individuality. Obviously, fishing is a very individualistic industry and that is one of my greatest regrets. If the 10,000 lobster fishers from villages that are dependent on lobster fishing presented a united front, then they would be a force to be reckoned with. Just look at the Fédération des producteurs de lait du Québec and at other powerful federations. I lament this state of affairs.

You spoke about the marketing efforts targeting other countries. There are, however, problems other than the fishery per se. Our region does not have any air transportation infrastructure. We do not have the proper infrastructure to bring a quality live product to market quickly. Add to this the glaring problem I spoke of earlier, namely that Boston is the trading hub of the lobster industry. Until now, very little effort has been made to get around the fact that everything is concentrated in Boston. Regardless of its provenance, the product is shipped from Boston to Europe. So then, the product is always American, even though it may come from Canada, from the Magdalen Islands. It is difficult to avoid this trading hub. I am not saying that it is impossible, but a very broad commission could be mandated to examine these important issues.

As for regional differences and the search for a common solution...We have made a collective effort and there are some positives to report. On examining the report of the FRCC, it becomes clear that the state of the fleet and the lobster fishery of each province are similar in many respects. While a minimum amount of latitude is required, particularly in terms of a federal-provincial program, the industry shares many common characteristics. People who attend the different gatherings or meetings like the one held recently in Moncton may hold different views. Obviously, representatives of organizations do not have absolute control over their members. Our associations, at least the ones in Quebec, are staffed by volunteers. People are free to express their views in committee.

11:50 a.m.

Conservative

John Weston Conservative West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast—Sea to Sky Country, BC

I have heard answers like this before. With respect to marketing, I'm not sure what the solution is. Is it up to each fisher, to associations like yours, or to the government to find the solution? I have yet to have that question answered clearly.

11:50 a.m.

Secretary-Treasurer, Alliance des pêcheurs professionnels du Québec

Léonard Poirier

Let me give you an example. The agricultural industry in Quebec is very powerful and very well organized. The government has shown its willingness to support the industry, going back all the way back to the 1940s and 1950s. More recently, in 1972, the industry has become unionized.

Agricultural producers speak with one voice. However, in 1972, the government granted them the power to speak with one voice. From that moment forward, they developed programs and joint plans with marketing options. The Fédération des producteurs de lait du Québec therefore can afford the luxury of marketing its products on television and elsewhere, because it has the capability to raise funds and take action.

Between you and me, what we have managed to accomplish with volunteers is nothing short of miraculous. Everything we have accomplished, we have done with volunteers. Any advances that the government and DFO have made have come through their work with our representatives. The problem is that we are not a powerful lobby, even though our representatives do have an opportunity to address this forum. In fact, our representatives are not officially recognized.

Let's take Quebec as an example. What if we were to go ahead with marketing boards or whatever. We face a problem that the agricultural industry doesn't have, since it is a provincial responsibility, first and foremost, even though the federal government is involved to some extent. Marketing boards operate at the provincial level. However, because the fishery is a federal responsibility, marketing boards wouldn't work.

That is why I say that we could focus on developing aid and income security programs for the medium and long term, and on harmonizing our operations. We could also work at harmonizing provincial and federal regulations.

At some point, we need to look at what we can do, and we need to try and sort out who is responsible for what exactly. We also need to try and understand why, if one party can do something that is good for the industry, the other party doesn't let it. We need to make an effort in that regard, because there are some serious shortcomings. Even if the will did exist...We have a plan.

Agricultural producers can limit production and decide, for instance, that they will produce no more than X litres of maple syrup this season. They can do that, because agriculture is a provincial area of responsibility.

Marketing boards can do what they like, such as negotiating prices. However, I cannot tell my fishers to fish four or five days a week, because the fishery falls within federal jurisdiction.

There is no agreement in place. We tried to negotiate a federal-provincial training agreement. In Quebec, we have the Bureau d'accréditation des pêcheurs et des aides-pêcheurs, but we do not have an agreement with the federal government. We would need to—

11:50 a.m.

Conservative

John Weston Conservative West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast—Sea to Sky Country, BC

Do you agree with—

11:50 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Rodney Weston

Mr. Weston, I'm sorry, your time has expired.

11:50 a.m.

Conservative

John Weston Conservative West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast—Sea to Sky Country, BC

Could I have a yes or no answer?

Without this solution, do you think the crisis will continue?

11:50 a.m.

Secretary-Treasurer, Alliance des pêcheurs professionnels du Québec

Léonard Poirier

I think it will be terribly difficult for us. As I said earlier, this crisis is more serious than the one we faced in 1990.

11:50 a.m.

Conservative

John Weston Conservative West Vancouver—Sunshine Coast—Sea to Sky Country, BC

Thank you.

11:50 a.m.

Conservative

The Chair Conservative Rodney Weston

Thank you.

Monsieur Poirier, thank you very much for coming today to meet with our committee. We appreciate you taking time out of your busy schedule to travel to Ottawa and to meet with us.

The committee will take a short recess while we go in camera for the next portion of our meeting.

[Proceedings continue in camera]