Government Operations Committee on Nov. 29th, 2023

[Irek Kusmierczyk, Liberal, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

This is exactly one of the key points we're making about this amendment, so this is important. This is absolutely pertinent, because we're talking about balancing transparency and the need to protect not just current investments but future investments. Dave speaks to this, and he says:

We have another company that's going to invest $3 billion with one company and they have a decision if they're going to come to Windsor or they're going to go to Mexico. And when they see this going on it's ridiculous.

That's what he says: “it's ridiculous.”

Mr. Chair, this amendment that we have before us is a balance between transparency and accountability and the responsibility I have to my community, a responsibility to make sure I don't put in jeopardy the historic investment in Windsor, the battery plant, but also that it doesn't jeopardize the billions of dollars of investment that are on our doorstep. They're on our doorstep. There are Korean and Japanese companies and other companies from Germany and elsewhere that are looking to locate, which are in Windsor right now—

[Rick Perkins, Conservative, South Shore—St. Margarets, NS]

I have a point of order.

[Irek Kusmierczyk, Liberal, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

—looking at land, looking at property, looking to locate—

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

I'm sorry, Mr. Kusmierczyk.

Go ahead, Mr. Perkins.

[Rick Perkins, Conservative, South Shore—St. Margarets, NS]

He has been asked a couple of times by the chair to stay relevant to the issue.

Can I remind the member what the issue—

[Irek Kusmierczyk, Liberal, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

This is about the issue.

[Rick Perkins, Conservative, South Shore—St. Margarets, NS]

The issue is whether or not the contracts are public or private. This is a dissertation on the general nature of the auto business in Windsor.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Thanks, Mr. Perkins.

Mr. Kusmierczyk, you have the floor, but please—

[Irek Kusmierczyk, Liberal, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

No, I appreciate it, and I—

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

I ask that you stick to the amendment, or at least come close to it.

Thanks.

[Irek Kusmierczyk, Liberal, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

This is at the absolute heart of the debate.

Again, we need to balance transparency and accountability with responsibility to make sure that we are not putting at risk all the investments we have lined up in communities like mine, and in Quebec. The Northvolt investment is $7 billion. There is a $10-billion Volkswagen investment in St. Thomas. The truth of the matter and the point that I'm making is that these investors are here and making a decision. When they make a decision, the winning community.... The difference between whether they invest in Windsor, Mexico or Alabama.... The margins are razor-thin. There's no medal, reward or prize for second-best.

If you're telling these companies that their contract—the sensitive commercial information and competitive advantages contained in those documents—will be made public for their competitors, you might as well hand those battery plants and investments to Alabama, Georgia, Michigan, Ohio, Mexico, Italy or Poland. You might as well hand those investments over. The margins are razor-thin. We don't need to be giving these companies a reason to not invest in Canada. It seems to me that some members of this committee are hell-bent on giving these companies reasons not to invest in Canada.

There's a balance here. The amendment my colleague put forward is reasonable and pragmatic. It would allow every single member of this committee to take a look at the unredacted documents. It would allow them to take a look at them, study them and see. It would allow Canadians to look at redacted information to make sure the sensitive information is not.... That can put these companies at a disadvantage. It could turn these companies away from Canada and deliver these investments into the arms of Alabama, Michigan or Ohio.

If you don't believe this threat is real, look at all the companies and investments that have been made in the United States, in the Great Lakes states. LG has seven battery plants in the United States. Michigan, Ohio and Indiana are doing everything they possibly can to land these investments. It seems as if some members of this committee are doing everything possible to lose these investments.

The margins are so thin, yet Canada has been successful. I can name seven investments off the top of my head right now that we've made in the last two years—billion-dollar investments in Canada. International companies want to build here. We fought tooth and nail to land the Stellantis-LG battery plant. Our community fought tooth and nail to land that investment. We fought tooth and nail to secure the investment through some really tough renegotiations. Now we're fighting like hell to protect our battery plant against untruth and a campaign of disinformation to erode public support for this battery plant and investment. That's what we're up against.

It's also important for us to know the context. Dave Cassidy came here. First of all, he was an electrician. He started from the bottom at Stellantis. As president, he led that organization and those members through some incredibly difficult times. We all remember 2008-09.

Dave had to stand up in front of his members and in front of the media in those dark times and tell them that they were losing a second shift and a third shift. He had to tell them that jobs were going to be cut.

This is important for me to get on record because it highlights the importance of this conversation and why we need to be responsible with our actions. We need to find a responsible path forward that can balance those two things. It's important for me to get the context on record.

What is the context?

Windsor was ground zero for the de-industrialization of Canada. When the Conservatives were in office, 300,000 manufacturing jobs left Canada.

[Garnett Genuis, Conservative, Sherwood Park—Fort Saskatchewan, AB]

I have a point of order on relevance again, Chair.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Mr. Kusmierczyk, we've been very patient with the relevance issue. I realize we always allow a fair amount of latitude, but we could get closer to the amendment on the motion. We can always continue this with the motion itself. Perhaps on the amendment—

[Irek Kusmierczyk, Liberal, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

Mr. Chair, not agreeing with the premise of what I'm saying is not grounds to limit my ability to address this committee.

[Rick Perkins, Conservative, South Shore—St. Margarets, NS]

I have a point of order.

Mr. Chair, you have warned the member three times. I think you've been more than lenient. The usual practice I've seen in other committees is if the member refuses the chair, then you move on to the next speaker.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

I'm sure Mr. Kusmierczyk will circle back to the amendment.

[Irek Kusmierczyk, Liberal, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

This is relevant.

Mr. Chair, I'll tell you why this is relevant.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Mr. Kusmierczyk, you have the floor. Please continue, but if you could please....

Go ahead.

[Irek Kusmierczyk, Liberal, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

Let me explain to you why it's relevant.

If we continue on this path with this circus and with this misinformation campaign, and if we continue with the original motion here to make all of these contracts public, it will risk the investment. This will turn back the clock. My community does not want to go back to those dark times.

I think we need to understand and Canadians need to understand those dark times and why we're fighting so hard here.

Again, it was 300,000 manufacturing jobs gone when the Conservatives were in power.

[Rick Perkins, Conservative, South Shore—St. Margarets, NS]

I have a point of order.

The repetition rule appears here, too. If you're going to filibuster, you should learn how to do it. One of them is you don't continue to repeat yourself.

Thanks.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

We do reach a point on the repetition. We do reach a point where we do have to get back more closely to the amendment.

Go ahead.

[Irek Kusmierczyk, Liberal, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

I talk again about the 300,000 jobs that left under the Conservatives. Windsor was ground zero. We had 11.2% unemployment—

[Rick Perkins, Conservative, South Shore—St. Margarets, NS]

On a point of order, this is repetition again.

[The Chair, Conservative, Kelly McCauley]

Go ahead, Mr. Kusmierczyk.

[Irek Kusmierczyk, Liberal, Windsor—Tecumseh, ON]

Again, if my colleague would allow me to finish, we had 11.2% unemployment in Windsor. When the Conservatives were in government and the present Leader of the Opposition was the Minister of Employment, we had 11.2% unemployment in Windsor.

That's the context. This is why we are fighting so hard.