Citizenship and Immigration Committee on June 5th, 2024

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Mr. Chair, I'm sorry. I can't raise my hand readily here, but that wasn't my question.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

If you raise your hand, I can see that, Madam Kwan, no problem. I will make sure I stop the clock. Thank you. You're doing very well. That's excellent.

Go ahead, please.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Thank you. I appreciate that.

That wasn't my question. My question was about the regulatory measures that are in place. What action will GAC take to address the regulatory measures for Hong Kongers who are here through the lifeboat scheme, before they have received their PR card or citizenship, to access their pension funds?

[Jennie Chen]

This is something that we'll have to take back internally to discuss the best way to approach this with local Hong Kong authorities. We are in regular contact with local Hong Kong authorities. As you know, there's a broad spectrum of issues with which we are dealing with the Government of Hong Kong, and we would be open to having such a discussion with Hong Kong authorities.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

All right. I would ask then for GAC to report back to this committee on what measures you have undertaken to assist Hong Kongers to access their pension funds, the Hong Kongers who are here through the special lifeboat scheme the government provided to them prior to their succeeding in getting their PR status. Could I get confirmation that undertaking will be followed up on?

[Jennie Chen]

Yes, I will commit to doing so.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

Thank you.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Thank you, Chair.

I'd like to now go to the IRCC officials.

We know that people cannot access their pension funds until they have PR status and that the current processing time for Hong Kongers is at least 21 months. The government has just introduced an extension of the program because they're not anticipating that Hong Kongers will be able to get their PR cards anytime soon. The extension will be at least three years, and while people wait, they can't access their funds.

What will IRCC do? Will IRCC actually ensure that Hong Kongers' PR applications will be processed within the original priority processing average, which was six months? Will IRCC materialize that for Hong Kongers so that they can expeditiously access their pension funds?

[Elizabeth Snow]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

The current processing time for the applications is under eight months. I'm unclear where the 21 months surfaced from, but it is under eight months. There are a considerable number of applications that did arrive in 2023 and that we will process through 2024, but, at the moment, there's no indication that processing will increase to 21 months.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

I have provided a spreadsheet to the minister's office with a variety of applications where people are just waiting and waiting. The average processing time is 21 months, if you actually talk to people on the ground about that. I'm happy to share that spreadsheet with officials, for sure, but of course those are not all of the people.

We had a briefing from officials—

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

Ms. Kwan, your time is up. We're at 6:27 right now, so I'll come back to you for the second round.

Mr. Redekopp, you have five minutes.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you to the witnesses for being here. I want to pick up on what Ms. Kwan was talking about.

In 2012, the former Conservative government, led by Stephen Harper, signed a treaty with Hong Kong. This was to deal with double taxation issues with regard to income tax. The purpose was to treat taxpayers fairly in each jurisdiction and to prevent tax sheltering and money laundering.

Ms. Chen, do you monitor the People's Republic of China and Hong Kong administrative government for compliance with the treaty, as signed by Prime Minister Harper?

[Jennie Chen]

We'll have to get back to you on this particular question.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

You're not aware of this treaty. That's shocking because it's very relevant.

I'll quote article 17 of schedule 1 of the treaty's implementation legislation:

Pensions (including lump sums) arising in a Party and paid to a resident of the other Party in consideration of past employment may be taxed in the Party in which they arise and according to the laws of that Party.

Essentially, it is specifically to deal with pensions that are in one or the other jurisdiction so that people are treated fairly in that situation.

In this treaty, there is no mention of the type of passport one must have in order for it to be applicable. There's nothing that I've been able to find that says that you can't have a BNO passport, or that you need this or you need that.

This is causing a problem because, as we heard from Manulife and Sunlife on Monday, they are conflicted. They have a PR card from Canada, yet it seems like the Hong Kong government, Beijing, has said that they can't take their money out.

Do you agree with my assessment that we have a problem here because the treaty doesn't actually mention that, yet the insurance companies are stuck because they don't know whether to follow Canadian law or Hong Kong law?

[Jennie Chen]

Thank you.

As mentioned, we're going to have to take that question and come back to you when we can look to our experts and do a full analysis.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

I take that to mean you'll provide us with a written report on this situation.

You also mentioned that you weren't aware of specific cases. Is there a way for someone to contact you to make you aware of a specific case?

[Jennie Chen]

I would welcome any individual cases being brought to our attention here. We are also actively engaged with stakeholders, so any cases can also be brought forward through those channels.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

I want to talk about Hong Kong visa applications to IRCC.

As Ms. Kwan was just mentioning, there are a lot of people struggling whom I've talked to—she has as well—who are waiting and waiting.

With this new measure introduced on May 27, there was a lot of confusion over the acknowledgement of receipt. People were saying that they were trying to apply for things and they weren't getting an acknowledgement of receipt.

Is that a necessary step if somebody is already in the system? Are they supposed to wait for that? What's the situation around that?

[Michelle Mascoll]

Thank you for the question.

Our website is being updated to reflect that individuals are not required to submit the acknowledgement of receipt with their application. They can be processed if they don't have that. It's not required as part of the application process.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

Okay, that would be very helpful because it's causing a lot of confusion in the community.

The other question I have is a bit more general, but along the same lines. There are 8,000 or 9,000 people currently in the queue, and you mentioned 37,000 who are in the system. We expect those numbers will probably come in through PR applications at some point. The humanitarian and compassionate category only allows for 13,000 people this year and then 8,000. How is the department going to deal with the influx of people processing in that category?

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

Ms. Snow.

[Elizabeth Snow]

I believe there was a similar question raised in the committee meeting about Gaza and the Sudan, and the department has made a commitment to come back on this matter. We will echo that sentiment here that the department will come back with more clarity on how the numbers in the H and C category will be parcelled out.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

Thank you. I don't have a lot of time left, but I just wanted to, again, reiterate that I saw some data that was from about 800 respondents, and the average application date of that group was back to May of last year. That would indicate that the processing times are quite a bit higher than the six months, or the eight months, as you described today. I think there is some disconnect in what people are experiencing, or what they believe they're experiencing, and what you're telling us, so I just wanted to make you aware of that.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

Thank you very much.

Now we will go to my dear friend from Davenport, Madam Dzerowicz.

Please go ahead, you have five minutes.

[Julie Dzerowicz, Liberal, Davenport, ON]

Thank you so much.

I just want to say thanks to all of the witnesses. Thanks for being here and for this great conversation, and to everyone for letting me be part of this conversation.

There are two parts to the study, and the first part is the access to the mandatory provident fund. My understanding is that there is an agreement, the Agreement on Social Security Between the Government of Canada and the Government of the People's Republic of China, which provides for coordination of pension benefits between Chinese and Canadian companies and employees, but it doesn't apply to the mandatory provident fund for Hong Kongers.

Maybe my question is for you, Mr. Linkruus.

Is there any other agreement that could govern or provide some guidance on how to deal with this outstanding issue?