Citizenship and Immigration Committee on June 5th, 2024

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

Thank you very much.

Now we will go to Mr. Redekopp.

Mr. Redekopp, you have five minutes. Please go ahead.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I just want to put on record that I'm very disappointed by the answers there today. We have IRCC deferring to Transport Canada for what's on a PR card. I'm shocked at that. We have GAC not understanding that there's a treaty between Canada and Hong Kong. We have Finance not understanding there are treaties to deal with pensions between the two countries. I'm somewhat dumbfounded at the lack of information, the lack of answers that we're getting today from people I thought would have the answers.

In light of that, very quickly, I want to move a quick motion. We need to get the minister here to do the supplementary estimates (A) before the end of June. Therefore, I'd like to move the following motion:

That, pursuant to Standing Order 108(2), the committee invite the Minister of Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship to appear for one hour with officials and invite departmental officials along with officials from the Immigration and Refugee Board to appear for one additional hour, on the Supplementary Estimates A as well as the subject matter of Main Estimates for the fiscal year 2024-25 before June 21, 2024.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

Thank you. The motion is in order.

Mr. El-Khoury, you are the first on the speaking list. Please go ahead.

[Fayçal El-Khoury, Liberal, Laval—Les Îles, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thanks to my colleague, Brad Redekopp, for moving this motion. However, as a member of the immigration committee, I can confirm to you that the agenda of the minister is extremely congested. We have a maximum of two more weeks. I believe it's going to be somewhat impossible for him.

If you would like to modify your motion and postpone it to September and afterward, it's up to you, but this is what I'm saying to you. I am convinced of it.

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

I would just say that I respect what you said. I don't know that you speak for the minister, though. He has a choice to make to come to this. I think we just put this on the table and whatever happens, happens.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

Thank you.

I have the speaking list.

Mr. Ali, please go ahead.

[Shafqat Ali, Liberal, Brampton Centre, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

I agree with Mr. El-Khoury that the time is too close. If we can give a bit of extra time, I think that would be a reasonable ask. We wouldn't have any issue on that. Perhaps we can bring a reasonable time for the minister that would be manageable for him and for us as a committee as well.

I just wanted to add that.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

I will go to Mr. Brunelle-Duceppe, then Mr. Chiang.

[Alexis Brunelle-Duceppe, Bloc, Lac-Saint-Jean, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

It's not up to us to say whether the deadline is reasonable or not. In any case, the minister will tell us whether he can appear or not. Let's look rationally at the content of the motion. Once everybody agrees, the minister will appear if he can. Everyone seems fine with what the motion says and interested in supporting it. Then, regardless of how much time is left, the minister will tell us whether he can appear or not.

We're not reprimanding him. We're just asking him to appear if he can. Personally, I wouldn't waste any more time on this. We have excellent witnesses and are having great discussions. I'm about to ask Mr. El‑Khoury to join the Bloc Québécois.

That said, Mr. Chair, I would like you to call the vote on this motion right away so we can continue this interesting discussion.

Thank you.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

On the speaking list, I have Mr. Chiang, Ms. Kwan, Mr. Ali and then Mr. El-Khoury. Once the list is exhausted, I will call the vote.

Now I will go to Mr. Chiang and then Ms. Kwan.

Mr. Chiang, go ahead, please.

[Paul Chiang, Liberal, Markham—Unionville, ON]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

I'm thinking about the timeline we have. With only two weeks left in this session, we could replace the date with “as soon as possible” for the minister to appear based on his schedule, because he has quite an extensive schedule with commitments across the country, not just in the House of Commons.

Perhaps if we could replace it with “as soon as possible”, it may be helpful for the minister to be here.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

Do you agree with that?

[Brad Redekopp, Conservative, Saskatoon West, SK]

No, because the supplementary estimates (A) are going to get reported automatically. We need to do this before that.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

Ms. Kwan, please go ahead.

[Jenny Kwan, NDP, Vancouver East, BC]

Thank you very much, Mr. Chair.

I think committee members are correct to say that it's not up to us to determine the minister's availability. All we can do, of course, is ask. The minister will say, “No, I'm sorry. I can't come, but here's an alternate date.” I think we should really just make the ask and see what the minister comes back with. This is normal practice.

We try to get the supplementaries done as soon as we can, and we have already had to delay that timeline because of other urgent studies, such as the Gaza and Sudan situations. When the minister showed up last time, we talked about that.

I think it's fair to make this request of the minister, and then they'll come back to us and tell us about his availability.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

There's a date attached to the motion. I would ask the clerk to read this motion just to make sure the members are very clear on what Mr. Redekopp is asking for.

Mr. Clerk, please go ahead.

[The Clerk of the Committee, Mr. Rémi Bourgault]

That, pursuant to Standing Order 108(2), the committee invite the Minister of Immigration, Refugees and Citizenship to appear for one hour with officials and invite departmental officials along with officials from the Immigration and Refugee Board to appear for one additional hour on the Supplementary Estimates (A), as well as the subject matter of Main Estimates for the fiscal year 2024-25, before June 21, 2024.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

Thank you.

I have Mr. Ali, Mr. El-Khoury and Ms. Dzerowicz.

Go ahead, Mr. Ali.

[Shafqat Ali, Liberal, Brampton Centre, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

I agree with everything, but I just want to give an option to the minister, if it's not possible for him until June 21, to give an alternate date when he would be appearing before the committee, as Ms. Kwan has suggested.

I think if we can add that into it, it would give him leverage so he's aligned with our—

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

I can entertain it only if there is an amendment to the motion. You've got to say that the motion is amended. Otherwise, I will call this a discussion.

I cannot propose it myself. If one of the honourable members asks to amend, just like Mr. Chiang earlier requested of Mr. Redekopp, the amended motion should be on the floor. Only then can I go to the amendment.

Mr. Ali, you still have the floor. I will go to Mr. El-Khoury afterwards.

[Shafqat Ali, Liberal, Brampton Centre, ON]

Can we suspend for one minute so we can talk? If it's a friendly amendment, we could work together on this.

[A voice]

It's not friendly.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

I will suspend for a few minutes.

[The Chair, Liberal, Sukh Dhaliwal]

We are back to business.

I have a speaking list.

Mr. Ali, you have the floor, and then Madam Dzerowicz, Mr. El-Khoury and Mr. Kmiec. I have four on the speaking list.

Oh, Mr. El-Khoury is off, so the person I have is Mr. Ali.

Mr. Ali, go ahead. The floor is for you.

[Shafqat Ali, Liberal, Brampton Centre, ON]

Thank you, Chair.

I suggested that I move a friendly amendment. At the end of the motion, add, “or an alternative date that the minister is available.”