Evidence of meeting #113 for Indigenous and Northern Affairs in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was reconciliation.
A video is available from Parliament.
12:30 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Patrick Weiler
Grand Chief, we're going to try this with the interpreters. We understand there could be just a short summary. It won't be perfect.
If you can continue, I still have about two and a half minutes left for Mr. McLeod.
12:30 p.m.
Gwich'in Tribal Council
Okay.
When we look at indigenous nations, such as Whitecap Dakota, we see their ability in that environment to tax a large, non-resident, transient population accessing their programs and services. There needs to be an ability not only for tax revenues but also for tax exemptions to work hand in hand for the benefit of indigenous governments.
As you look at cases such as Whitecap Dakota's, they have been able to leverage their proximity to a major centre to provide services, and I believe in some of the rare cases.... It is a rare case that you have non-indigenous residents requesting access to services such as hospitals and schools as in Whitecap Dakota. That has been, in part, because of their ability to implement sales and excise taxes in their home community.
As you know, they are the most recent self-governing nation in this country, having made their agreement effective last September.
12:30 p.m.
Liberal
Michael McLeod Liberal Northwest Territories, NT
Grand Chief, I want to interrupt you, because I need to ask this next question regarding clawbacks.
How important is it to GTC that, as you increase your own-source revenue with taxation powers, for example, it doesn't impact other funding streams from the federal government?
We saw this as a challenge when the Tłı̨chǫ were trying to bring forward their self-government negotiations. The Conservative federal government of the day was insisting that they use own-source revenue. Anything generated would offset what was coming from the federal government.
12:30 p.m.
Gwich'in Tribal Council
It's incredibly important, because, as you know, unless it's tied to non-renewable resource extraction, we do not see private investment in our region. This is not to mention the fact that our low population does not present effective business cases for any entity, investment or industry that does not have large government subsidies.
It needs to be part of a broader discussion on our fiscal chapter as it relates to self-government.
12:30 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Patrick Weiler
Thank you very much, Mr. McLeod.
Mr. Lemire, you have the floor for four minutes.
12:30 p.m.
Bloc
Sébastien Lemire Bloc Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Grand Chief Kyikavichik, during our last meeting, you made some good suggestions for economic reconciliation, which are also in the strategy Ms. Ottmann presented.
Do you think the creation of an indigenous import and export organization is a suitable way to facilitate trade with the U.S. and assert free trade zones?
12:30 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Patrick Weiler
Grand Chief, just so you know, on your Zoom screen, you will see a globe. If you click on that globe, you can select English and then you'll have live translation from the proceedings into English.
Mr. Lemire, could you repeat your question?
12:30 p.m.
Bloc
Sébastien Lemire Bloc Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC
With pleasure, Mr. Chair.
Grand Chief Kyikavichik, during our meeting, you made some good suggestions for economic reconciliation, which are also in the strategy Ms. Ottmann presented.
Do you think the creation of an indigenous import and export organization is a suitable way to facilitate trade with the U.S. and assert free trade zones as well?
12:30 p.m.
Gwich'in Tribal Council
We certainly believe so.
For the Gwich'in nation, if we look prior to the establishment of the Canada-U.S. border, we spanned Alaska, Yukon and the Northwest Territories, and we numbered 9,000 strong in total. The implementation of this international border has restricted trade, whereas in the past it was very common.
Like other nations, such as Six Nations and the Mohawk in southern Canada, the Gwich'in also have that need for cross-border mobility. We believe that these types of agreements, whether through an organization or not, would help facilitate that trade, particularly in our region, where we have such limited access to supplies, groceries and lumber. If Alaska opens up a supply route for our communities, that certainly is a lot closer than places such as Edmonton, which we currently depend upon for the resupply of our communities. Logistically, especially with low water levels, it is incredibly important as we move forward.
12:30 p.m.
Bloc
Sébastien Lemire Bloc Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC
The government should adopt a law that guarantees first nations' inherent rights and eliminates all the loopholes that often lead to rights being violated or ignored by the people promoting projects on ancestral lands.
Is free, prior and informed consent an essential condition for first nations' development?
12:35 p.m.
Gwich'in Tribal Council
The question wasn't fully translated on the system.
12:35 p.m.
Bloc
Sébastien Lemire Bloc Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC
I'll repeat the last part of my question.
Do you think that free, prior and informed consent is an essential condition for developing economic projects with first nations?
12:35 p.m.
Gwich'in Tribal Council
Absolutely. We look at free, prior and informed consent as shared decision-making with all levels of government. In our opinion, it does not compose a veto, but it opens up the discussion with governments and industry on potential investments in indigenous territories. However, without that early and frequent communication ahead of time, that makes things very difficult. When that is in place, it does allow for a beneficial discussion between all parties.
12:35 p.m.
Bloc
Sébastien Lemire Bloc Abitibi—Témiscamingue, QC
Ms. Ottmann or Grand Chief Abram, do you want to add anything regarding free, prior and informed consent?
12:35 p.m.
Association of Iroquois and Allied Indians
Sure. As we know that it has been recognized by the Supreme Court as now being federal law, now that UNDA has passed, [Technical difficulty—Editor] that has to be quantified by individual first nations. What that means is that they're going to have their own guidelines as to what would constitute free, prior and informed consent for them.
That's something I cannot do. Each individual first nation is going to say, “Here are the kinds of discussions that we have to have on a particular subject.” Once we have those discussions, then maybe we can have our free, prior and informed consent for whatever it is to go forward.
12:35 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Patrick Weiler
You have my apologies, Mr. Lemire.
Your time is up. I know we could talk about this for many meetings.
With that, we'll go to our last speaker of the second round here.
Ms. Idlout, you have four minutes.
12:35 p.m.
NDP
Lori Idlout NDP Nunavut, NU
[Member spoke in Inuktitut, interpreted as follows:]
Thank you, Chairperson.
Thank you, Ken. I'm happy to see you again. I recognize you.
Ken and Dr. Ottmann, you can both respond. I will ask you the same question.
Indigenous Services Canada has indicated that they intend to “work with Indigenous partners to bring forward an economic reconciliation framework which will remove barriers and support Indigenous visions for economic prosperity.”
What does economic reconciliation look like and mean to you?
Ken, you can go first.
12:35 p.m.
Gwich'in Tribal Council
Màhsi’, MP Idlout. It's great to see you again as well. I often appreciate our many discussions on issues impacting the northern territories.
The Gwich'in seek what every Canadian seeks and at times takes for granted: a good job, a quality home, proper schools, access to athletics and opportunities for our young people, sound infrastructure and a level of local economic development. In a western economy, this only occurs with major investment by existing levels of government and private industry. As I mentioned earlier, our communities are often prevented from...this private investment. That limits our local economic development.
In its simple form, I see economic reconciliation being the creation of an economy that allows entrepreneurs to set up local businesses to provide the amenities many of our communities do not have access to at the current time—the simple things I mentioned that are taken for granted, like a Tim Hortons, for example, in some of our major centres and the ability to access food and things people in southern Canada enjoy. Those are things many of our people look to have in the future. It's having the ability for that economy, whereby we are investing in local businesses and people have good jobs and live in good, energy-efficient homes. Right now, in the north, as you all know, heat and power are incredibly expensive. We need to change this for the benefit of our residents, moving forward, so they don't ever feel the need to move elsewhere—particularly to the south—for economic reasons.
Economic reconciliation, for us, means bringing a lot of what we see in southern Canada and the western economy into our communities, allowing for investment by our people and others.
Màhsi’.
June 10th, 2024 / 12:40 p.m.
President, First Nations University of Canada
As was spoken of earlier, the economic engagement of indigenous peoples has been systematically legislated out. There were thriving and engaging economies and trade north, south, east and west before reserves were created. Past systems.... All of those barriers did not enable indigenous peoples to engage in the economy.
Now there is, I'd say, this awakening to economic reconciliation, which is very important. We have more entrepreneurship and a growing number of indigenous businesses. Indigenous governments have never stopped trying to engage in the economy and develop self-determining communities. The barrier is always....
There is a commitment to economic reconciliation by ISC. I believe it's about $1.5 million. The—
12:40 p.m.
Liberal
The Chair Liberal Patrick Weiler
Dr. Ottmann, I'm afraid I'm going to have to do this again. I apologize for this, but we are very short on time and we are over time again.
Dr. Ottmann, Grand Chief Abram and Grand Chief Kyikavichik, thank you so much for your testimony today on our study. I'm sure it will inform a really important report and recommendations for the government, so I want to thank you.
At this time, we are going to suspend the meeting to go in camera for committee business.
Thank you very much, everybody.
[Proceedings continue in camera]