Evidence of meeting #132 for Public Accounts in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was rcmp.
A video is available from Parliament.
6 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative John Williamson
Thank you very much. That is the time.
We're beginning the fourth and final round.
Mr. Stewart, you have the floor for five minutes, please.
June 18th, 2024 / 6 p.m.
Conservative
Jake Stewart Conservative Miramichi—Grand Lake, NB
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
I'd like to thank the commissioner and deputy commissioner for being here today.
With both the chair of the committee and me being from New Brunswick, I would like to start off by paying respect to our three fallen heroes from Moncton. It's 10 years this month since we lost RCMP Constables Fabrice Gevaudan, Dave Ross and Douglas Larche.
Our thoughts and prayers are with their families, whose lives were changed forever on that tragic June day in Moncton. We will never forget the bravery that those three men and their RCMP colleagues showed in protecting their fellow citizens in my home province of New Brunswick.
Here's one of the questions I have here today. I understand that the RCMP has a budget of $49 million for the foreign interference investigation. I'm just curious to see if there's a separate budget for the RCMP to investigate the ArriveCAN scandal. If so, what's the amount for that budget?
6 p.m.
Commr Michael Duheme
I'll start before I hand it over to Mark.
I'll start by recognizing and thanking you for your comments with regard to our three fallen members. In fact, it's 10 years ago that this tragic and sad incident happened that took the lives of three brave individuals, three brave RCMP members.
As for the budget, the amount you referred to was $48.9 million. That was in an MC that went through a couple of months ago. Mark could further expand, but the budget for the organization is.... There's a pot of money that comes into the organization and it's not always dedicated to a certain type of offence that we're investigating.
Mark can elaborate on the budget when it comes to federal policing.
6 p.m.
D/Commr Mark Flynn
Yes, I think it's key, as the commissioner stated, that the $48.9 million is funding to look at a certain type of problem, not to fund a specific investigation. When you're looking at the broad federal policing budget, without getting into the complicated elements of it, we're over $800 million in the budget for federal policing. You'll see anything up to maybe a billion dollars and anything down to $600 million, and we apply that based on the priorities we have.
6 p.m.
Conservative
Jake Stewart Conservative Miramichi—Grand Lake, NB
Thank you.
Was there a specific number just for the ArriveCAN investigation? That's kind of what I was looking for, that number, if you had it.
6 p.m.
D/Commr Mark Flynn
We do not allocate a set number of dollars. There are investigative documents that speak to budget projections for investigations, but they are certainly not limited to that. It is all just to inform senior management of what an investigation is costing so that we can include that in our projections.
6 p.m.
Conservative
Jake Stewart Conservative Miramichi—Grand Lake, NB
Okay. Thank you.
One of the questions I had...and this has never been my sort of immediate file, but I've had a lot of questions about it over the past year. One thing really struck me, and it could be coincidental, but I was curious to find out your opinion. The day that Kristian Firth was brought before the bar, during that testimony—
6 p.m.
Conservative
6 p.m.
Some hon. members
Oh, oh!
6 p.m.
Conservative
Jake Stewart Conservative Miramichi—Grand Lake, NB
I'm sorry—that's a different story.
During his testimony, he said something that caught my interest. I'm paraphrasing here, but he essentially said that the RCMP investigated his home the day before. It might have been the morning of, but in my mind right now, it's the day before.
Is there anything significant about that proximity?
6 p.m.
D/Commr Mark Flynn
Nothing whatsoever. I'm not aware of any connection between the two activities.
6:05 p.m.
Commr Michael Duheme
Nor, Mr. Chair, do we have a list of people with when they're appearing and in front of what committee they're appearing.
6:05 p.m.
Conservative
Jake Stewart Conservative Miramichi—Grand Lake, NB
This was the second time it happened in history, and the first time in 111 years, so it was very publicly known that something significant was going to transpire in the House of Commons. I had never heard of it myself, to be honest, at the time, but I was curious to see if there's a link between the proximity.
Do you feel the RCMP has the full co-operation of the Office of the Auditor General to do this investigation?
6:05 p.m.
Commr Michael Duheme
I know the Auditor General. We have a really good relationship, and I am convinced that we have 100% co-operation from her and her team.
6:05 p.m.
Conservative
Jake Stewart Conservative Miramichi—Grand Lake, NB
Thank you.
One question I have is sort of a hypothetical.
Do you feel that you have sufficient resources, and what would the timeline be to carry out the investigation?
6:05 p.m.
Commr Michael Duheme
As I responded earlier, I never pronounce myself on the timeline for any investigation, because when you interview one person that might open up 10 different people you must interview afterwards. I use also the example of our cellphones today. If you go 10 years ago, it was just a cellphone, or maybe 15 years ago, and right now it's a mini computer. Some are encrypted, so it takes additional time for us. This is just one cellphone, so you can imagine when we seize laptops and whatnot. It just takes more time.
6:05 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative John Williamson
Thank you very much.
Ms. Yip, you have the floor for five minutes.
6:05 p.m.
Liberal
Jean Yip Liberal Scarborough—Agincourt, ON
Thank you.
Have you had any issues in receiving information from government agencies, such as CBSA, in this case, in the RCMP's investigation?
6:05 p.m.
D/Commr Mark Flynn
I'm not aware of any issues, but I'm also not at a level to know all those details. There's certainly been nothing raised to my attention.
6:05 p.m.
D/Commr Mark Flynn
Again, there's nothing that's been raised to my attention.
