Environment committee  I don't know the numbers. The Department of Finance manages the process of the trust. A financial institution actually manages the trust and the provinces draw that down for their initiatives according to their priorities.

Environment committee  I should reiterate, Chair, that the whole principle behind this approach is that the provinces have many of the levers that are necessary to make the public policy decisions that will result in GHG reductions, for example, in the regulation of the electric power generation sector, municipal transportation, and so on.

Environment committee  What we did in this initiative was to leave it to provincial governments in varying circumstances across the country to use this funding for support as they undertook major initiatives, whether it was public infrastructure or whatever it might be. Those are their decisions, and that was deliberate.

Environment committee  Well, when the money was made available to the provinces, they would use it for their plans. We know, through collaboration with provinces, what their GHG reduction strategies are. But we do not insist on knowing what particular dollar out of that trust arrangement goes to what particular purposes.

Environment committee  I don't have that data with me, but we'll examine to see what we do have.

Environment committee  Chair, I'll respond to our planned amount of advertising for 2008-09 and ask my colleague if we have that information on the spending in the previous year. We're expected to spend in advertising about $6.38 million in 2008-09, and $6.18 million would be for the promotion of the vehicle scrappage incentive program.

Environment committee  As for last year, I'll ask Madam Ruta.

Environment committee  I think the primary work on that was done in the Department of Finance. I think there would have been some work with them. Let me check with my colleague. The Department of Finance would have done the primary work on that.

Environment committee  Well, let me answer first generally and then my colleague can add if she thinks it's pertinent to do so. Between the publication of the initial framework and the final policy decisions in March, there was a series of what I would describe as very extensive consultations with three sources, principally provincial governments, industry, and environmental groups, to do a couple of things: to test the responses--

Environment committee  I'd be delighted to do that, Chairman. With me are Alan Latourelle, chief executive officer of the Canada Parks Agency; Mr. Peter Sylvester, president of the Canadian Environmental Assessment Agency; and Mr. David McLaughlin, president and CEO of the National Round Table on the Environment and the Economy.

Environment committee  Exactly, Chair. I'll begin. I'm very grateful to be here with the committee and indeed on this occasion with my colleagues in the portfolio. I think it's the first time we have done that, certainly any time recently. With me also from the Department of the Environment is Cécile Cléroux, who is the assistant deputy minister of our largest branch, the environmental stewardship branch, and Basia Ruta, our chief financial officer in the department.

Public Accounts committee  Mr. Chairman, I'll do my best. I indicated at the beginning the four roles that Environment Canada plays with respect to greening government operations. Our role for sustainable development strategies is somewhat comparable to my colleague's department's role in procurement and greening government operations.

Public Accounts committee  I can't answer that directly; it's theoretical. It's not my prerogative to put in place any particular system. What I would say is that the level of target setting, the measurement of targets, the analysis of how best to achieve them, and the measurement on performance are the elements that we have to come to grips with, as the commissioner has laid out, under whatever system of governance we are assigned as a department.

Public Accounts committee  Mr. Chairman, if it would be helpful to the committee, I would add that the nature of the measures will vary across the operation. For example, on the renewal of the government fleet, I think there is relatively little we could do, even if we wanted to, to fudge the numbers. We would be reporting to the Treasury Board, as the commissioner has indicated, through internal audit and then through whatever external audits occur to provide the data about what the expenditures have been in fleet renewal and what the compliance has been with the standard across government for fuel efficiency, for example.

Public Accounts committee  That decision really was no different from any other government program where every year the government's estimates--