Public Accounts committee  Mr. Williams, if I may, I can ask Carol Beal, who was in Mr. McGrath's position at the time, what her sense was about direction. I think she would be the most relevant person.

Public Accounts committee  Tim, can you just walk the committee through some of the considerations that we took into account, and some that the auditor might have?

Public Accounts committee  Yes, there was. Tim, can you describe the administrative requirement that we had at the time?

Public Accounts committee  It is awkward.

Public Accounts committee  We did have extensive discussions around this number. We explained how we saw the number, and the auditor on the job made a decision to see it the way they did. We explained where we got our number, and I guess the auditor would have to explain how they got their number.

Public Accounts committee  Mr. Chairman, we don't agree with that number. We looked at the difference in rate between Place Bonaventure and Place Victoria over a five-year lease, and we looked at the cost of fit-up that was being avoided, and the cost of moving that was being avoided, and we concluded that it would be cheaper to leave the agency in Place Victoria if they didn't need more space.

Public Accounts committee  I'm sorry--is the point you're making that it still did cost $2.1 million? Is that the point you're making?

Public Accounts committee  The cost of the unproductive rent is $2.1 million, yes.

Public Accounts committee  That is right. That is the cost.

Public Accounts committee  That's correct.

Public Accounts committee  Yes, Mr. Chairman, we definitely do. We do seek to get the best value. I think it's important to think about it as two separate requirements. When the agency said they needed extra space and a fit-up, you have a conclusion that it's better to go to Place Bonaventure because of the costs that would be involved.

Public Accounts committee  Mr. Chairman, my colleague has correctly described the situation. The Department of Public Works and Government Services has evolved. There was a time when we really tried to lean over backwards. We still are obliged to help departments carry out their operational requirements, and when a client comes to us and says “Here's my operational need--I need to be in this place”, we take that into account.

Public Accounts committee  Michelle, do you want to answer that?

Public Accounts committee  Yes. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Members of the committee, we appreciate being here to discuss with you the subject of the leased office space at Place Victoria in Montreal, as it was reported in the Auditor General's report of May 2006. As you mentioned, I have with me today Mr.Tim McGrath, our acting assistant deputy minister for real property, and Mr.

Government Operations committee  Madam Chair, when the contract was put in place, it was given the scope to take the whole period of what we thought the transformation would require--five years and maybe even a bit longer--so that it didn't restrict us from accessing that resource. At the same time, the contract specifically provided that if we had needed to re-profile it and accelerate work, that was envisaged and authorized to take place.