Public Accounts committee  Indeed it was an unprecedented year. The best representation of our revenue streams are outlined on page 17. Quite honestly, notwithstanding the fact that we had the largest economic shock since the Great Depression, our income tax streams held up pretty well. The economy bounced back pretty strongly.

Public Accounts committee  Historically, our tax transfer programs that are refundable are categorized as a negative revenue. That speaks to the point that you were trying to make. I could ask the Auditor General to speak in terms of the accounting principles behind that, but traditionally our GST credit, which I believe is one of our largest refundable tax credits at the household level, has always been treated as a negative revenue.

Public Accounts committee  Thank you for the question, because I think it establishes some clarification. There are two elements. The bulk of the revenues are repaid, for lack of a better term, 90% plus through the climate action incentive payment. The remainder, which is the $98 million you're referencing, is through federal programming, where you're trying to target the not-for-profit sector, schools, hospitals, or small and medium-sized enterprises.

Public Accounts committee  I can't deny that it is delivered through a government program.

Public Accounts committee  Quite honestly, it's the miracle of low interest rates and just the impact that low interest rates have had on public debt charges as we roll over debt and refinance at lower rates, again, just speaking to this secular decline in rates but the more dramatic recent decline in rates and how that's fed through the government's market debt stock.

Public Accounts committee  —but just on the algorithmic mathematical principle here, I think we could probably appreciate that we're trying to establish this comparability, which is why they're taken into consideration to achieve this bottom line. I understand where others come out to in terms of the commentary, but that's just the mechanical explanation of what's going on there.

Public Accounts committee  If it needs to be a matter of record to the committee, you can see the comparison between G7 countries on page 37. We outline the mechanics of going from the accumulated deficit basis, which is the debt metric you see in the public accounts and what the federal government reports on in its updates and budgets: how you get from there to this definition of “total government net debt”, which is what the IMF uses to compare on an internationally comparable basis.

Public Accounts committee  I'd best reference page 34 of volume I of the Public Accounts, which shows our interest ratio as a percentage of revenues and the downward trajectory over the last 30 years or so. This is owed to the secular decline in interest rates and the government refinancing its debt at an effective interest rate that's much lower than it was 30 years ago.

Finance committee  That's a difficult question to answer, quite honestly. I don't think I could pick any one element out of this bill. From a macroeconomic objective—this isn't much of a response in consideration of the local and regional issues and hardships faced by your community, Mr. Member—it's to take the edge off inflation over the coming quarter and get it back to target and to normalize those physical and monetary policies so that the economy is operating at full capacity, but there are these negative spillovers from high inflation affecting households and businesses, for sure.

Finance committee  Listen, again, it's not very region- or locale-specific. The government, in the department, does their best—

Finance committee  There will be a few of us who will stay at the table while the minister is giving her testimony.

Finance committee  I want to say May 7, but I want to be very cautious. I would invite someone from ESDC just to speak up.

Finance committee  That's fair enough.

Finance committee  I apologize. I'd have to get back to the member. Again I'm just cautious about dates of new financing arrangements and when the facility will close.

Finance committee  Again, I apologize to the member. I don't have the dates. I don't believe there's anyone on the line who could speak to the dynamics of the LEEF facility.