Health committee  Smoking and lung cancer is a factor of 20--and 300 if asbestos is involved.

Health committee  I'm sorry. Would you repeat what you're asking?

Health committee  That's a very tough question. I can hardly presume. I would say to allow due process to continue, which is what's been going on, and allow Health Canada to continue its review process. SC 6 should not be considered a closed book. Science is never a closed book. Dr. Blank, in speaking about the Interphone study, said there were indications approaching statistical significance and maybe reaching statistical significance.

Health committee  I have no particular comment on it other than to say it is part of the environment within which the standard-setting committees evaluate the studies that are coming along and take them into account. It remains a study that.... What could I say? It was not conclusive in establishing any effects.

Health committee  Yes, if I may. Actually, I'm trying to address what you've raised, and I will also use the example that was raised previously about peanut allergies. Peanut allergies are established as an effect in certain people, so it's reasonable to take action to deal with established effects.

Health committee  I can't say that's a question I can presume to answer except as a citizen. I don't think it's a scientific question. I would say personally that we benefit greatly from these technologies. I have two grandsons now, one not six months old yet, the other about three years old, and our family uses cellphones, Wi-Fi, and all the technology.

Health committee  If I may, just to try to expand on this issue, I said that when I started out I was involved in the standards and guidelines for microwave ovens. At that time, the standards and guidelines covered the frequency range from 10 megahertz to 100 megahertz, which at the time was like CB radios, and it included AM and FM and the lower frequency TV stations.

Health committee  Thank you, Madam Chair. I don't want to take too much time. I think questions and answers are more relevant and I'm here to try to share my experience with you on these issues. Just for the record, Ms. Pieterson mentioned the RED Act. I started my career in non-ionizing radiation with drafting regulations related to microwave ovens in the early 1970s under the RED Act.

Health committee  Yes, if I may, just to follow up on that point. I think what Dr. Habash has raised is really an issue of the distinction between a decision based on science and a decision based on social, political, and personal considerations. If I understand what he said for his own personal use of a cellphone, for example, he would reduce it, but he doesn't believe in changing the standards because there's not evidence to change them.

Health committee  Yes, if I may. This committee is not a place to look at the technical issues that are associated with information like the example from our colleague from Greece. It has always been my opinion that there are difficulties in a lot of the in vitro studies that are done, because there is not enough consideration taken for the fact that the actual distribution of energy within the exposure chambers that are being used, be it for cellular or animal studies, or even the human measurements that have been done in the case of some of the military and industrial studies....

Health committee  I'm not aware that it has changed.

Health committee  It really alludes to the statement that I made in my opening comments. The scientific literature that's out there is immense, and the references and so on are available to the IEEE. They're available worldwide. They're available on the Internet now. Anybody who wants to sit and look at all those studies again, which have been reviewed by committees with due diligence, with responsibility, with interest....

Health committee  Well, it has been a variety of clients, clients like CBC, members of the public, various employers who have installations that raise concerns among the workers, and so on and so forth. I've continued to follow this whole issue. As I said, I was involved in the standards-setting process and the reviews that were done that led to things like SC-6, the ICNIRP standard, and so on and so forth.

Health committee  Thank you, Madam Chairman. The request to attend this meeting came as a bit of a surprise to me. I didn't really have any material to prepare. I simply came to offer my perspective and views on this issue. I think I'll leave it at that and leave more time for questions and discussion.

Health committee  Just to provide some context, I started my career related to microwaves in the early seventies here at Health Canada. I proceeded from that to a job with the Ontario Ministry of Labour, where I was dealing with non-ionizing radiation in a broader sense. I got involved in lasers, microwaves, RF sealers, and all of those sorts of applications in industry and such.