Fisheries committee  It's complicated as we've said. This is going to be my concluding comment here. I want to thank you for listening to what we had to share about the salmon. I hope you can do some good work to create the changes that are necessary. To the question, whether it's the Skeena, the Fraser or the Nass, all of these systems are the same because there are other things outside.

Fisheries committee  One of the issues is the fettering of the minister's authority. Every time we develop a plan and move forward, we always get pushed back in that regard. You don't have any decision-making authority. There needs to be power-sharing with the local communities living in those regions, because it's all centralized power out of Ottawa.

Fisheries committee  I think we need to come up with a plan, as your colleague said. Honourable Mr. Hardie spoke about a “master plan”. I think that's the idea. That needs to be put together, and then there need to be adequate resources to do the work, simply at a high level. I also think—not to be critical—that DFO is conflicted.

Fisheries committee  I believe that things are out of balance and there are too many seals. You can see it when they go to feed on the herring and the salmon in the river systems. There's a massive amount of seals and sea lions, and I believe there does need to be a culling program, but it has to be managed properly to maintain the balance.

Fisheries committee  I don't believe we do. I believe it's getting better. I'm not sure if you're familiar with Dick Beamish, who used to be the head of the Pacific Biological Station in Nanaimo. He's an Order of Canada recipient scientist and it was his passion to go out. He raised money to go out, and I think they're now going into their second or third year of research in the north Pacific, where the salmon are going.

Fisheries committee  Sorry, you're going to have to ask that first question again.

Fisheries committee  No, they're not. The reason why they're not is that a lot of times the money gets used up in administrative processes. Honestly, there's not enough money in the treasury to do what we need to do. There is absolutely not. However, through a collaborative approach, working with first nations through indigenous guardians out on the land who are in connection with those resources—whether it's salmon or caribou—it makes sense to work with the local people because Canada doesn't have enough money to put people out into these rural locations.

Fisheries committee  I think the intention is good, the mandate letters and commitment to reconciliation, but sometimes.... The government is big and it's a challenge, but the intention is good. Everybody's experience is different. We've been fairly aggressive as a nation to advance a reconciliation agreement with Canada and British Columbia, and in that context, it's served us well.

Fisheries committee  They're both kind of leading questions. How could I say no? We do need to collaborate—the province and the feds and first nations—in a respectful, tripartite manner. It goes back to that issue of respect. Absolutely, salmon are in crisis. There are no ifs, ands or buts. This didn't just happen.

Fisheries committee  I think that Tawney has the right idea with what they're doing at West Coast Aquatic. The Delgamuukw decision said that we are all here to stay. We need to work together. We need to set the arena so that we can put our interests forward. This isn't unprecedented. We have been in this process, in particular with the coastal first nations and the War in the Woods, where we had loggers and other governments and the first nations come together to come up with a more sustainable development around forest management.

Fisheries committee  We have a doctrine of priority. Conservation comes first. We are going to have to do everything in our power to save wild salmon. That's number one. Number two is with food, social and ceremonial. I get coho from our hatchery and smoke them and they are great fish. It's the same thing with dog salmon; it's a great fish.

Fisheries committee  We have an oral history. That's how our knowledge has been transferred intergenerationally for 700 generations for the Heiltsuk people. We are at risk of losing our language, but our young people are stepping up and they're taking responsibility to learn the language. As I said earlier, that's where the knowledge is, because there are certain things you could say in our language that you can't say in English or in French.

Fisheries committee  The weirs are ingenious in their simplicity. As we know if we're coast dwellers, the tide rises and falls every six hours. As the tide rises, those rock weirs catch the salmon. They come in and they get stuck in there and our people used to go and get them. We had a very sophisticated governance system.

Fisheries committee  I don't have any authority to speak for all first nations, first of all. I can speak for myself and I am a leader of my nation. I think we have had a salmon hatchery for well over 30 years. All of the other systems are basically barren. We would get a little bit of recruitment from our salmon hatcheries, but there is a conflict with this idea of hatcheries because it's the whole issue of the genetics and the monoculture of the hatcheries.

Fisheries committee  I absolutely agree that the minister has to put into effect a verbal commitment. It's a challenge, because the status quo has been a heavy industrial driver, and it has been to our detriment. You brought up the issue of herring, which is a main keystone species, a forage fish, a feeder fish for salmon.