Industry committee  To build on the agreement that this bill needs to be passed and to put into perspective, again, the consequences of its not being passed, it's been well documented that Canada is a laggard in this area by the Financial Action Task Force, by Transparency International—ourselves at the global level—based on G20 beneficial ownership high-level principles, and by the bad guys themselves.

Industry committee  Thank you for the question. To build on my colleague's point, when you're looking at the numbers exactly.... By their very nature, they're secretive, so they're difficult to find. You want to look at impact. I think that might also wind up being something that gets.... If there's any last holdout province that doesn't want to join this registry and, all of a sudden, we see a certain province's limited partnerships starting to skyrocket as other provinces go down, there's pressure to be put on that particular holdout jurisdiction: Why do you want to be Canada's remaining secrecy jurisdiction?

Industry committee  Thank you for the question. I don't think, for one, lowering the threshold from 25% to 10% and a risk-based approach are mutually exclusive. I think they actually go hand in hand. I would note that the 25% isn't so much a standard as it was an initial global recommendation that everyone just kind of grabbed on to.

Industry committee  Thank you very much for that question. Indeed, the issue of beneficial ownership transparency in government procurement, licensing, permits and grants is a very serious issue. While we've been pushing for a registry all these years, if the government were to adopt beneficial ownership transparency as part of the due diligence process for procurement, grants, licences and permits, the power of the person and the power of the government to issue those various processes would be incredibly powerful in compelling a lot of companies to come forward with that information and deterring those who want to exploit our system.

Industry committee  Thank you for the question. We'd be more than happy to circulate the publication on the study we conducted to any committee member who wants it. In terms of striking the balance between having the data and achieving the mandate or the purpose of the bill, we found that there was balance there, but there was also the opt-out option, of course, for anybody who felt that their safety was genuinely in peril.

Industry committee  Mr. Chairman and members of the committee, thank you for inviting me to speak to you today. My name is James Cohen, and I am the executive director of Transparency International Canada. TI Canada is a registered charity and is the Canadian chapter of Transparency International, the world's leading anti-corruption movement.

Finance committee  There's definitely a link with the mechanisms that money launderers provide to the person committing the crime. Inevitably, at the end of the day, you're inevitably trying to get that dirty money into the licit economy. Something that's been in the news a lot, especially in British Columbia, is this Vancouver model of money laundering, this idea of the money coming over from underground banks in mainland China into Canada into underground banks and being used to purchase property.

Finance committee  If I'm understanding your question correctly, it's once we have the registry and if other countries have the registry including if the FATF increases the standards on beneficial ownership registry, will this help us find money launderers. I just want to make sure that I have it correct.

Finance committee  Yes, it will help. I want to repeat there is no silver bullet, but this is a huge gap, not just in Canada but you have to look at it globally. A lot of countries are undergoing this problem of housing markets that are already being crunched on supply being exploited by those who see new condo developments or new houses just as a safety deposit box for their illicit funds.

Finance committee  Yes. As I recall from the government's proposal in the federal budget in 2021, this year, Innovation, Science and Economic Development Canada is meant to conduct a study on how to implement a publicly accessible registry in Canada, with the idea that such a registry would be up and online by 2025.

Finance committee  Thank you for the question. Without doing an analysis of what the exact right amount is to dissuade people and going into any kind of behaviour analysis, I would say at a very basic level that you are looking at what the cost of doing business is. In this case, it's the business of crime.

Finance committee  As it currently stands, it would be, because they already are getting around any indicators we have very well. They are getting around the indicators we have to figure out the proceeds of crime or terrorist financing coming into Canada. As I said in the beginning—and we've seen it—sure, you can set up a company that's incorporated in the federal jurisdiction or in any one of Canada's jurisdictions, but that could have come from money from a separate jurisdiction, a separate secrecy jurisdiction.

Finance committee  Could you repeat the question?

Finance committee  I was invited here to talk about Bill C-8. I will respond to this briefly. I heard of the use of illegal blockades, but I have still to hear what the definition of that term specifically means. I would encourage the government to use a very high standard of transparency going forward.

Finance committee  Mr. Chairman and members of the committee, thank you for inviting me back to speak to you today. My name is James Cohen, and I am the executive director of Transparency International Canada. TI Canada is a registered charity and is the Canadian chapter of Transparency International, the world's leading anti-corruption movement.