Bill C-354

An Act to amend the Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission Act (Quebec’s cultural distinctiveness and French-speaking communities)

This enactment amends the Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission Act to provide that the Commission must, in furtherance of its objects and in the exercise of its powers, consult with the Government of Quebec or the governments of the other provinces, as the case may be, before regulating aspects of the Canadian broadcasting system that relate to the cultural distinctiveness of Quebec or that concern French-speaking markets.

[Niki Ashton, NDP, Churchill—Keewatinook Aski, MB]

Thank you very much.

I'd like to thank the witnesses very much for joining us today.

Ms. Roy, as president of the FCFA, you clearly explain the situation in which we find ourselves in Canada, that is, the danger posed by the decline of French. Tools have been made available to us through Bill C‑13, and I'm very proud to have worked closely with the former minister of official languages to get a better bill passed. However, it doesn't change the need to move things forward in all areas, if there's a political will to stop this decline of French.

Let's go back to Bill C‑354, which states, among other things, that the CRTC must consult provincial governments other than the government of Quebec about French‑language markets when regulating and monitoring the Canadian broadcasting system.

According to everything we've seen from their governments, do you believe that people like Blaine Higgs in New Brunswick or Danielle Smith in Alberta are acting in the interests of francophone communities and aiming to protect their rights? Do you think it's essential to add measures in this bill to ensure that francophone communities themselves are heard by the CRTC, not only to protect their rights, but also to halt the decline of French in our country?

[Martin Champoux, Bloc, Drummond, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

First of all, I want to say how impressed I am by Mr. Noormohamed's French skills. He spoke only French for his entire six minutes. Given that we are studying a bill that deals with protecting French and francophone culture, I find that admirable. I just wanted to point that out. Hats off to him.

Ladies and gentlemen, I am pleased to see the three of you here. We've met on a number of occasions, in many different situations, and I've had the opportunity to discuss with some of you the concerns around Bill C‑354 and the provisions relating to consultation with the provinces.

Ms. Henrie‑Cadieux, you said in your remarks that you completely agree with the Quebec consultation mechanism and believe that it is good not only for Quebec, but also for French throughout Canada. Obviously, I find it very rewarding to see that Quebec, which strongly defends French and has powerful tools to defend francophone culture, has an influence outside Quebec. Can you expand on that?

[Jacques Gourde, Conservative, Lévis—Lotbinière, QC]

Thank you, Ms. Roy.

We talked to representatives from the CRTC earlier. They are relatively lukewarm—pardon the expression—to Bill C‑354 because they don't want to give an advantage to the Government of Quebec, or any other provincial government, for that matter. The CRTC prefers to cast a wide net in its consultations and invites everyone who wants to submit briefs to do so, including governments and associations across Canada. It says that it does not necessarily place greater importance on government briefs than on briefs submitted by associations.

Have you noticed the CRTC's way of doing things? Could you comment on that, please?

[Liane Roy, President, Fédération des communautés francophones et acadienne du Canada]

Good evening, Madam Chair and members of the committee.

Thank you for inviting us and our colleague from the Fédération culturelle canadienne‑française, the FCCF, to testify before you today.

My name is Liane Roy, and I'm accompanied by our director of communications, Serge Quinty, who is attending the meeting in person and who will be able to answer your questions.

The Fédération des communautés francophones et acadienne du Canada, or FCFA, is the national voice of 2.8 million French‑speaking Canadians living in a minority situation in nine provinces and three territories. The FCFA is the head of a national network of some 900 French‑language organizations and institutions across the country. Our communities are determined to live in French, and they work to do so every day.

Over the years, we have invested in a number of spaces and sectors necessary for the vitality of our francophonie, including the media and audiovisual space. We have developed a network of francophone community radio stations. We have an educational television channel, TFO, which is present not only in Ontario, but also in Manitoba and other provinces. We are constantly working with Radio‑Canada to ensure that our communities are better represented, not only in the content broadcast by regional stations, but also in national programs and newscasts.

In recent years, two major pieces of legislation in our country have been modernized. The FCFA has taken a leadership role in the modernization of the Official Languages Act. At the same time, we supported the FCCF's work to ensure that the new Online Streaming Act adequately takes into account the realities and needs of our communities. One of the major gains in this regard is the addition of section 5.2 to the Online Streaming Act, which requires the Canadian Radio‑television and Telecommunications Commission, or CRTC, to consult official language minority communities when it is preparing to make decisions that have an impact on them. This clause is essential because, I admit, the CRTC's consideration of our realities has been uneven over the years, and even unsatisfactory in a number of cases.

For 18 years now, there has been a discussion group reserved for dialogue between the CRTC and official language minority communities, the CRTC‑OLMC discussion group. As its name suggests, it is essentially a forum for discussion and not an advisory body. Since October 2023, our communities have been calling for the group to become a proper advisory committee. This transformation is necessary, given the CRTC's new obligations under the Online Streaming Act.

All that said, we agree on the importance of the CRTC conducting much more systematic consultations on the realities of francophone markets in the country, including the cultural specificity of Quebec.

However, part of Bill C‑354 poses a problem, the part dealing with francophone markets outside Quebec. As worded, the bill provides that the CRTC will have to consult the governments of provinces other than Quebec on the realities of the francophone markets there. However, to be perfectly frank with you, the sensitivity of these governments to the francophonie varies. Some governments have difficult relations with their francophone communities. The francophone and Acadian communities and the organizations that represent them are in a much better position to describe the realities of the francophone markets at the CRTC, as required by the bill. For example, the FCFA, the FCCF, provincial and territorial francophone organizations, the Alliance nationale de l'industrie musicale and the Alliance des producteurs francophones du Canada have all been part of the CRTC‑OLMC discussion group for 18 years now. This shows that the CRTC understands and recognizes their legitimacy in speaking on behalf of francophone and Acadian communities. We therefore respectfully ask you to amend Bill C‑354 so that the organizations of the francophone and Acadian communities, and not the provincial governments, are the CRTC's first points of contact for reporting on the realities of francophone markets outside Quebec.

Thank you for your attention. We are ready to answer your questions.

[Manon Henrie-Cadieux]

Thank you for inviting the FCCF to discuss the opportunities afforded by Bill C‑354, which the Bloc Québécois introduced. The bill seeks to amend the Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission Act to make it mandatory for the CRTC to consult with the Government of Quebec on Quebec's cultural distinctiveness, before furthering its objects and exercising its powers in respect of aspects of the Canadian broadcasting system. We very much support that. The fact that Quebec would have an additional say in matters relating to its cultural distinctiveness and the CRTC would increase the importance of protecting and promoting French. That, in turn, would benefit us.

The FCCF is asking the government to ensure that its directions to the CRTC help to broaden the impact of measures to support the French language, ranging from supports for francophone production to the discoverability of francophone cultural content. You, our elected officials, just finished working on a modernized Official Languages Act in order to strengthen the obligations set out in the act. It reaffirms the goal of achieving substantive equality between the official languages, and now is the time for action.

Leading up to October's francophonie summit in Paris, stronger Canadian leadership is needed in order to overcome the barriers that threaten the future of the French language and francophone culture all over the world. This bill would go a long way on that front.

As representatives of the vital cultural sector, we are here today to highlight the importance of removing a reference from Bill C‑354. Unlike Quebec, the other provinces should not be called upon to inform the CRTC about matters relating to their French-speaking markets. That is asking them to do the impossible. That misguided notion should be removed from the bill, and groups like ours should instead be designated to represent francophone communities when it comes to these issues. We have legitimate mandates, effective mechanisms for advocacy and the necessary expertise. We have a decades-long track record of helping to shape policies that support the development of francophone communities. We are the only stakeholders with the on-the-ground knowledge to carry out this responsibility.

We would be grateful to you for determining that groups like ours are best equipped to inform the CRTC of what Canada's francophone minority communities need. The choices the country is about to make to support our language and culture are more critical than ever. At stake is the diversity of our cultural expression, its future and influence at home and abroad.

Thank you for this opportunity. I look forward to answering your questions.

[Manon Henrie-Cadieux, Director, Strategy and government relations, Fédération culturelle canadienne-française]

Good afternoon, members of the Standing Committee on Canadian Heritage, Madam Chair, and ladies and gentlemen.

I sincerely appreciate the opportunity to appear before you today. My name is Manon Henrie‑Cadieux, and I am the director of strategy and government relations at the Fédération culturelle canadienne-française, or FCCF for short.

I should say that the FCCF is the political voice of arts and culture in Canadian and Acadian francophone communities at the national level. The FCCF co‑operates closely with, and has the support of, the Fédération des communautés francophones et acadienne du Canada in providing leadership in broadcasting matters.

A clear and active stakeholder in the Yale report and the bills that followed, the FCCF helped to highlight the specific circumstances, concerns and needs of francophone minority communities. We are deeply engaged in sustained advocacy with the CRTC, to ensure that the Online Streaming Act is effectively implemented. Our active involvement in the current public consultations attests to that advocacy, especially regarding the strengthened provisions on the duty to consult communities and the way they are to be consulted. Our impactful contribution to the dedicated forum for communication between the CRTC and OLMCs, the CRTC-OLMC Discussion Group, also attests to the FCCF's advocacy work.

Thank you for the invitation to discuss the opportunities afforded by Bill C‑354, which the Bloc Québécois introduced.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

I call the meeting back to order, please.

We are meeting with our second round of witnesses on the bill.

I'm sorry, everyone. I am just a little punchy. I came in on a red-eye, and I don't even know what I'm saying right now.

We're hearing from witnesses on Bill C-354. I will introduce them.

We have, from the Fédération culturelle canadienne-française, Manon Henrie-Cadieux, director of strategy and government relations. From the Fédération des communautés francophones et acadienne du Canada, we have Liane Roy, president, by video conference, and Serge Quinty, director of communications.

Please begin now. You have five minutes to present per group.

I want to thank you for coming.

We'll begin with Manon-Henrie Cadieux for five minutes, please.

[Rachael Thomas, Conservative, Lethbridge, AB]

Sure.

One thing that is continually happening at this table is a lot of talk about consulting with Quebec. However, you'll note that Bill C-354 also requires you to consult with the governments of other provinces.

Is that correct?

[Martin Champoux, Bloc, Drummond, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I'll continue in the same vein as my colleague Mr. Noormohamed by talking about the notion of burden.

So far, I have heard all kinds of arguments against Bill C-354. None of them so far have made me blink, and none have led me to believe that, in the end, it may not be a good idea. None have led me to believe that we should discuss any aspect in particular, other than an amendment that may be discussed later on concerning consultations with the governments of the other provinces.

Mr. Shortliffe and Mr. Hutton, you said that passing the bill would add a workload to what you already have. It is a matter of informing the Government of Quebec of a study or a hearing that you are conducting on a particular topic. Explain to me how such a process could be considered an additional burden on an already full schedule, as I would like to know how you view that approach.

[Jacques Gourde, Conservative, Lévis—Lotbinière, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

I want to thank the witnesses for joining us today.

In its current form, does Bill C‑354 contain any factors that bind the CRTC in its day‑to‑day operations?

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

I call this meeting to order.

Welcome to meeting number 126 of the House of Commons Standing Committee on Canadian Heritage. I would like to acknowledge that this meeting is taking place on the unceded traditional territory of the Algonquin Anishinabe people.

Pursuant to the order of reference of Wednesday, February 28, 2024, the committee is resuming its consideration of Bill C‑354.

We're going to begin, and I'm going to give you the usual housekeeping speech. Please read the little card you have on the table in front of you, witnesses. Because of sound quality, we need to make sure you don't have any devices, such as your hearing devices, close to your microphones. There's a little decal on your table. Can you put it face down on that when you're not using it? Also, you have to use the black earphones and not your own. We're not allowed to take photographs, because this is going to be put on the website anyway, and you'll be able to get what you'd need out of it.

We're in a hybrid form, and for those of you who are virtual—I think Niki Ashton is virtual—when you need to speak, please raise your hand on your website. For those of you who are in the room, please put your hand up, and I'll recognize you based on when you put your hand up, or at least we will try. Please wait until I recognize you by name before speaking.

I now want to welcome our witnesses. I want to thank you for waiting, because normally we were supposed to start at four o'clock. We're half an hour late, but votes occurred, and they tend to push things back a little bit.

From 4:30 to 5:20, we're going to have witnesses from the Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission, the CRTC. It's represented by Scott Shortliffe, executive director of broadcasting; Scott Hutton, chief of consumer, research and communications; and Rachelle Frenette, legal counsel. Welcome.

You have five minutes to present, not each of you, but one of you, on behalf of CRTC. You probably know who that's going to be, so we shall begin for five minutes, please.

Mr. Shortliffe.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

Having ended that, let's go back to the project. We have five minutes.

Are there any questions on Bill C-354?

On the bill, I have Taleeb Noormohamed.

[Martin Champoux, Bloc, Drummond, QC]

Thank you, Madam Chair.

Ladies and gentlemen, it's an honour for me to speak to the members of the committee today about Bill C-354, which was sponsored in the House of Commons by my colleague the member for La Pointe-de-l'Île, Mario Beaulieu.

As my colleague could not be here today, I'm happy to be able to speak on his behalf about our bill, which is very straightforward.

Subsection 12(1) under the heading “In relation to broadcasting” in the Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission Act, states: “The objects and powers of the Commission in relation to broadcasting are as set out in the Broadcasting Act”.

We propose the addition of a “Consultation” section and a new subsection 12(1.1):

Consultation (1.1) The Commission shall consult with the Government of Quebec about the cultural distinctiveness of Quebec and with the governments of the other provinces about the French-speaking markets in those provinces before furthering the objects and exercising the powers referred to in subsection (1) in respect of the aspects of the Canadian broadcasting system that concern those matters.

This bill is not really very complicated. It constitutes a response to the express request submitted on February 4, 2023 by Quebec's Minister of Culture and Communications, Mathieu Lacombe, in a letter he had sent to Mr. Pablo Rodriguez, the then Minister of Canadian Heritage.

At the time, the Standing Committee on Canadian Heritage had completed its study of Bill C-11, whose purpose was to amend the Broadcasting Act. Following study in the Senate, the bill was referred back to the House to obtain approval for the final amendments proposed by the Senate.

The recommendations in the letter to Mr. Rodriguez included the Quebec minister's demand, or firm suggestion, that Quebec be consulted systematically when the Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission, the CRTC, was developing regulations and decisions that could have an impact on Quebec and francophone culture, and on the Quebec broadcasting system.

The Bloc Québécois is convinced that telecommunications and broadcasting are extremely important for the vitality of Quebec's culture. Broadcasting has a direct impact on our language and culture. Bill C-354 is a modest attempt at a minimal response to the expectations and concerns of Quebeckers with respect to the culture and management of their broadcasting ecosystem.

Quebec has always developed its own rules for the broadcasting sector and has always striven for more autonomy. I would like to take you back to 1929, when the premier of Quebec at the time was Louis‑Alexandre Taschereau, who adopted the first “law respecting broadcasting in this province”. That was the actual name of the act. Later, in the 1930s, the federal government followed his lead and adopted a broadcasting act, which led to the establishment of the CRTC as we know it today.

However, over the years, various successive Quebec governments—and they were certainly not all sovereignists—with several federalist Liberal governments among others, working towards more autonomy and more power for the Government of Quebec with respect to broadcasting. In 2008, Christine St‑Pierre and Benoît Pelletier, both Liberal ministers in the Quebec government, sent the following letter:

This letter is written to inform the federal government of Quebec's desire to begin talks, as soon as possible, with a view to concluding a Canada-Quebec agreement for the broadcasting and telecommunications sector and an agreement relating to culture. Considering the distinct culture of Quebec, the only French-speaking state in North America, we feel that concluding such an administrative agreement would make it possible to better reflect the specific characteristics of Quebec content in broadcasting and telecommunications, and would serve as recognition of the importance of protecting and promoting Quebec's specific culture.

CRTC decisions have an impact on francophone and Quebec culture. CRTC decisions have an impact on Quebec broadcasting, and we think that it is important for Quebec to automatically be consulted in advance by the CRTC when it is undertaking work on Quebec and francophone broadcasting and culture.

Thank you, Madam Chair.

[The Chair, Liberal, Hedy Fry]

I call this meeting back to order.

Pursuant to the order of reference of Wednesday, February 28, 2024, we are commencing consideration of Bill C-354, an act to amend the Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission Act, regarding Quebec’s cultural distinctiveness and French-speaking communities.

The sponsor of this bill was Mario Beaulieu. We have Mr. Martin Champoux, who is going to present on his behalf because he is not able to be here.

Mr. Champoux, you have five minutes for your opening statement. I will give you a 30-second cue when you're getting there.

Thank you.

[The Vice-Chair, Conservative, Kevin Waugh]

Yes, that's right.

Could we have a vote on the schedule Mr. Noormohamed has brought out here, starting with safe sport on June 6 and going to Bill C-354 and the rest on June 11, June 13, June 18 and June 20?

(Motion agreed to: yeas 9; nays 1)

Thank you.

Does anyone move to adjourn?