Public Accounts Committee on May 14th, 2024

[Jean Yip, Liberal, Scarborough—Agincourt, ON]

What is CBSA doing to ensure that résumés from prospective contractors and subcontractors are not being copied and pasted from requirement rubrics?

[Erin O'Gorman]

There are several things. To the specific question that you've asked, we are having potential contractors attest to the CVs that are put forward to CBSA. We are separating the review of those contracts and having it done in conjunction with our procurement group. We've also implemented a quality assurance function that will pull those CVs and their evaluations on a regular basis, to do checks on them.

[Jean Yip, Liberal, Scarborough—Agincourt, ON]

What is CBSA's policy or rule regarding work-related meetings with stakeholders and prospective contractors that take place off-site?

[Erin O'Gorman]

Our code of conduct was clear about both real and perceived conflicts that arise when employees are engaging with consultants and contractors outside of the specific business at hand. That being said, at CBSA we have put in a requirement that employees are to disclose any interactions with contractors outside of a contracting process, just to make sure that's clear to everybody and there's transparency around that.

[Jean Yip, Liberal, Scarborough—Agincourt, ON]

What about gifts?

[Erin O'Gorman]

The code spoke to the receipt of gifts. Employees are not to accept gifts from contractors. There's a provision in the course of diplomatic relations where some kinds of gifts under a certain value can be received and those over a certain value declared, but that's covered in the code of conduct.

[Jean Yip, Liberal, Scarborough—Agincourt, ON]

Do you know what the values are?

[Erin O'Gorman]

I can get back to the committee on that. It's enumerated.

[Jean Yip, Liberal, Scarborough—Agincourt, ON]

Okay, thanks.

During Mr. Firth's testimony on April 17, he explained that it is a regular practice for contractors to replace resources on the guidance of the client all the time, depending on whether there were discrepancies with their experience, whether they were not working very well or whether they needed to move on to another project.

Do you agree? Is this common practice?

[Erin O'Gorman]

I don't know whether it's common practice. I understand that, when certain resources are put on a contract and those contracts are in place for some number of years, they will move on to other jobs or not be available at the time.

I can't speak as to whether it's common practice. Certainly, if consultants or contractors aren't performing, that's a separate issue, and we would absolutely seek to remove them from the contract and have somebody else, so I would see those as two different issues, but I can't speak to the frequency with which that takes place.

[Jean Yip, Liberal, Scarborough—Agincourt, ON]

Did the CBSA provide guidance to GC Strategies, instructing them to subcontract out the work?

[Erin O'Gorman]

No.

[Jean Yip, Liberal, Scarborough—Agincourt, ON]

You mentioned in your opening statement that your mandate is to serve and protect Canadians. Do you feel, moving forward, that this is something the CBSA can continue to do? What are your thoughts, given this experience?

[Erin O'Gorman]

I've never for one moment doubted the CBSA's ability to serve and protect Canadians. Every day they find contraband. Last year, they welcomed about 86 million travellers. They are welcoming and processing asylum seekers. We are working with police partners on all manner of investigations.

If you're referring to the situations that have arisen with regard to the lack of contracting paperwork, we are addressing that on all fronts, but I wouldn't want to confuse the extremely important need to be beyond reproach in our contracting and in our transparency with the work of serving and protecting Canadians every day.

[The Chair, Conservative, John Williamson]

Thank you very much.

Ms. Sinclair‑Desgagné, you now have the floor for six minutes.

[Nathalie Sinclair-Desgagné, Bloc, Terrebonne, QC]

Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you to the witnesses for being here today.

Ms. O'Gorman, I'll have some questions for you a little later.

Mr. Ailapperuma, you were involved in almost every stage of the CBSA process to award contracts to GC Strategies. Your name appears in a lot of places.

I would like to start with the document that the Auditor General gave us, which includes all the invitations that agency employees received from GC Strategies. Your name appears four times. You apparently received emails inviting you to events in September 2019 and April 2021. Can you tell us whether you were at those events?

[Chulaka Ailapperuma, Director, Canada Border Services Agency]

I did not attend any events in 2019. I did attend two events in 2020.

[Nathalie Sinclair-Desgagné, Bloc, Terrebonne, QC]

You were at two events in 2020. What were they?

[Chulaka Ailapperuma]

There was one event that was related to virtual whisky tasting. The other one was an event at Lansdowne Park.

[Nathalie Sinclair-Desgagné, Bloc, Terrebonne, QC]

What other agency employees attended the whisky tasting?

[Chulaka Ailapperuma]

From my recollection, my senior managers attended those events, as well as some of my colleagues.

[Nathalie Sinclair-Desgagné, Bloc, Terrebonne, QC]

Can you please give us some names?

[Chulaka Ailapperuma]

It was Mr. Utano and Mr. MacDonald, who were my senior managers, and Mr. Steve Lauzon attended one of the events, the whiskey tasting, and then the other attendees were consultants.

[Nathalie Sinclair-Desgagné, Bloc, Terrebonne, QC]

Your senior managers were at the event. Were other people at the agency informed of these invitations? Did you follow the process in the code of conduct requiring that an employee inform a senior manager when a consultant tries to give them a gift, whether it be cash or a gift in kind like this?

[Chulaka Ailapperuma]

I did not specifically inform anyone. My superiors were aware that I was attending.