Evidence of meeting #121 for Public Accounts in the 44th Parliament, 1st Session. (The original version is on Parliament’s site, as are the minutes.) The winning word was cbsa.
A video is available from Parliament.
12:15 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative John Williamson
Thank you.
(Motion as amended agreed to: yeas 10; nays 0)
Thank you all for ratifying, with a slight amendment, the work plan that was sent to you all.
We're now going back to our witnesses.
Mr. Brock, you have the floor.
12:15 p.m.
Conservative
Larry Brock Conservative Brantford—Brant, ON
Thank you, Chair.
Ms. O'Gorman, you appeared at the OGGO committee on October 24, 2023. You informed this committee before your appearance at that meeting that you'd visited the PCO at 80 Wellington at 2 p.m. You then attended the OGGO committee at 3:30 p.m., and, the next morning, you visited the PCO at 80 Wellington again. This is all pursuant to your calendar.
Did you meet with PMO officials?
12:15 p.m.
Conservative
12:15 p.m.
President, Canada Border Services Agency
I don't know the specific meeting that you're talking about, but if I was at PCO, I would have been—
12:15 p.m.
Conservative
Larry Brock Conservative Brantford—Brant, ON
Ma'am, I just repeated the meetings that you attended. One was on October 24, one hour before your committee appearance, and the other followed your committee appearance, on October 25. I'll ask again: Did you meet with PMO officials on both of those dates?
12:15 p.m.
President, Canada Border Services Agency
I would have to review my calendar. I don't recall meeting in person with PMO officials in any meetings. This was more than six months ago.
Mr. Chair, is there a specific question that the member wants an answer to? Pointing out dates of meetings from six months ago, I'm hard pressed to—
12:15 p.m.
Conservative
Larry Brock Conservative Brantford—Brant, ON
Ma'am, this is important. This is an important question, and we want an answer to it.
Whom at the PMO and the PCO did you meet with before and after your appearance at the OGGO committee?
12:15 p.m.
President, Canada Border Services Agency
I would have to review my calendar. I don't have it in front of me.
12:15 p.m.
Conservative
Larry Brock Conservative Brantford—Brant, ON
You'll provide this committee with the names of everyone you met with in the PMO and the PCO.
12:15 p.m.
President, Canada Border Services Agency
Mr. Chair, the member is stating as a fact that I met with the PMO. I have not agreed to any facts. Please let that be clear.
12:15 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative John Williamson
I stopped the clock, Mr. Brock. There's a request for information. I believe Ms. O'Gorman said she would check her schedule.
I just wanted to clarify that. I want to double-check. I don't want to put words in your mouth.
12:15 p.m.
President, Canada Border Services Agency
I believe the member has my schedule, so if the people aren't listed, I can see if I can go in and find that. I will take that back.
12:15 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative John Williamson
Thank you very much.
Mr. Brock, you have two minutes, 50 seconds. It's back to you.
12:15 p.m.
Conservative
12:15 p.m.
President, Canada Border Services Agency
As I said, I don't recall those meetings. I don't have the information in front of me. I have spoken to PCO—
12:15 p.m.
Conservative
Larry Brock Conservative Brantford—Brant, ON
I'll stop you right there. Ms. O'Gorman, it is really funny that now, some several months removed, you have great difficulty remembering your attendance at the PCO and PMO, yet when the question was put to you by me at an earlier appearance, you remembered exactly attending, and you told us at that time that it was a mere coincidence that you were attending before your committee appearance.
I'm now telling you that this is what you had said previously, so it's very coincidental, madam, that you can't remember now. Clearly, this was about your appearance at committee, and it was clearly about the ArriveCAN study.
Do you dispute that?
12:20 p.m.
President, Canada Border Services Agency
I do. I absolutely dispute that. Your question was not, “Did you meet with the Privy Council Office or the Prime Minister's Office before your appearance, to discuss your appearance?” Had that been the question, I would have said no. I have never met with PMO with regard to any of my—
12:20 p.m.
President, Canada Border Services Agency
I believe there was a statement that was erroneous that I am fixing. If the question was asking if I met with the Prime Minister's Office—
12:20 p.m.
Conservative
12:20 p.m.
Conservative
The Chair Conservative John Williamson
Order, order, order.
Ms. Yip, do you have a point of order? I think I am going to pre-empt it, but go ahead. I see your hand up.
12:20 p.m.
Liberal
Jean Yip Liberal Scarborough—Agincourt, ON
My point of order is that the witness should be allowed to answer, and also that 80 Wellington is the PCO and not the PMO.